--- Log opened Tue Aug 28 00:00:27 2018
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00:24 #navit: < genesis> KaZeR : do you have any new on gpsbabel navit format support ?
00:36 #navit: < Beggar> Hmm there is an alive soul around O.O
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11:36 #navit: < Beggar> hi again and again....
11:39 #navit: < Beggar> I am trying to make a map to use in navit for some time now. I want to make a map from a city extracted from planet.osm. Maptool can convert it to .bin file, but there are lots of lines around, and those lines look like the streets on the map, but they are not streets and the routing do not use them as streets, but they steel visualy look like streets.
11:41 #navit: < Beggar> those lines are not present on the original osm map, at least I can not see them using the web interface. I do not know what those lines represent, but I would love to get rid of them and leave just the streets on the map.
11:42 #navit: < Beggar> I have tried -w option in maptool without sucess, tried -6 too, tried the multipolygon tool mentioned in the forum and some stuff with osmosis, but until now I have not find any way to convert the osm map to .bin without this side undesirable effect.
11:57 #navit: < Beggar> tried -W (W not w) just now and got seg fault
12:39 #navit: < Beggar> I just compiled maptool and tried the -W again and seg fault in the same way as before. I am trying to convert normally now, this is probably my last attempt to make something useful out of this as far as I am lacking ideas 
12:51 #navit: < genesis> sorry i don't know yet map, i'm a beginner.
12:51 #navit: < genesis> just try to get some tomtom_asc poi file right now :)
12:53 #navit: < Beggar> It seens to have been covnerted sucessifully now, I will test the map in the device.
12:53 #navit: < Beggar> If it works now, I can tell for surethat maptool shipped with Debian is buggy
12:54 #navit: < Beggar> genesis, hi, alive people.
12:54 #navit: < Beggar> person*
12:55 #navit: < genesis> yes i'd hope you can use my nixos's navit soon
12:55 #navit: < genesis> but i can't know when it'll be put in nixos's cache.
12:55 #navit: < Beggar> if you are a beginner I am an pre-alpha-begginner
12:56 #navit: < genesis> a beginner in navit, not in computer science :)
13:59 #navit: < Beggar> maptool in Debian stretch is buggy, it does not covnert the osm maps to .bin correctly. The last version on github works ok.
14:01 #navit: < genesis> debian is buggy for many reasons, i hate this kind of distribution
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15:04 #navit: <+jkoan> Hi Beggar
15:04 #navit: <+jkoan> I am one of the team members ;)
15:05 #navit: <+jkoan> You are right that the maptool version in debian is really outdated. Compiling navit and maptool is the current way to go
15:06 #navit: <@KaZeR> hi there
15:07 #navit: <+jkoan> Also sorry that I missed you yesterday, normally at least one person is active in the evenings hours (utc timezone)
15:07 #navit: <+jkoan> Hi KaZeR
15:07 #navit: <+jkoan> Could you review the PRs which are open? ^^
15:08 #navit: <+jkoan> We need to speed up development again ;)
15:08 #navit: < Beggar> I like Debian, it is a good general purpose distro.  Even with all the quirks. genesis 
15:10 #navit: <+jkoan> Beggar: I also like debian, even though I currently use Ubuntu for desktop computers. (Gnome, also before they switched back to it)
15:10 #navit: < Beggar> Hi jkoan, I should have done it in the first place, I would not need to wait long hours converting broken stuff if I compiled it. Bu I should not complain, at least I read the osm implementation and learn something haha
15:11 #navit: <+jkoan> Nice :)
15:11 #navit: <+jkoan> Are you also a dev?
15:12 #navit: < Beggar> jkoan, about the channel, not a problem, at least there is someone here and the project still on going, if you see the website you will notice that somethimes you think navit is dead or outdated.
15:12 #navit: <+jkoan> Yes, I know :(
15:13 #navit: <+jkoan> Nut we are working on a new website :D
15:13 #navit: <+jkoan> *but
15:14 #navit: < Beggar> No, i am no developer, just got interest in navit because I got a STIRFIII module and wanted to play with it using a laptop. well at least it was the goal 2 weeks ago, now I am playing with the OSD stuff and track log.
15:14 #navit: <+jkoan> Did you get the GPS device working?
15:15 #navit: < Beggar> yes, gpsd accepted it easily.
15:15 #navit: <+jkoan> Yep, that would also be the answer I would give you for this device :)
15:15 #navit: < genesis> https://www.ebay.fr/itm/GPS-Recepteur-VK-162-2M-cable-USB-magnetique-Ublox-GPS-RasPi-Win-7-8-10-Linux/263846821791?hash=item3d6e7eff9f:g:hYgAAOSwxphbF5X8 do you know if it's good ?
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15:16 #navit: <+jkoan> genesis: ublox is a good brand, so why not
15:16 #navit: <+jkoan> Beggar: is the laptop the device you finally want to use navit on?
15:18 #navit:  * genesis project to make a tablet pc for gps in motorhome :)
15:18 #navit: < Beggar> jkoan, yes, but I also got an old GPS navi with no aparent brand and installed navit on it, the navigator is pretty old somethin aroun 2010 haha
15:19 #navit: < Beggar> genesis, I do not know this device, but the one I used is based on this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SiRFstarIII
15:19 #navit: < Beggar> it is an pretty generic device for GPS
15:19 #navit: < genesis> i'd to, sya
15:20 #navit: <+jkoan> Beggar: do you know what OS it runs? Probably wince?
15:20 #navit: < Beggar> yes, Wince 4.5 or something like that
15:21 #navit: <+jkoan> Okay, than it should be possible ;)
15:21 #navit: < Beggar> the notebook is a Debian Stretch, but I compiled the kernel adn made some clean up on the system to maximize the battery
15:21 #navit: <+jkoan> Nice :D
15:21 #navit: < Beggar> jkoan, well a bit laggy compared to the original IGO, but better than ahving maps from 2008 hahaha
15:22 #navit: <+jkoan> Yes :D
15:22 #navit: <+jkoan> Did you already got navit on the wince device?
15:24 #navit: < Beggar> I did it around 1 hour ago,used the same map I covnerted with the newly compiled maptool.
15:25 #navit: < Beggar> I did not tried it, but there is support to GLONASS ?
15:26 #navit: <+jkoan> I think that we had some pull requests on this, but I don't know if it is working
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16:22 #navit: <@KaZeR> aerostitch: \o/
16:22 #navit: <@KaZeR> jkoan: yep!
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16:26 #navit: <+jkoan> KaZeR: I also found an tomtom device on ebay which *should* have docking connector and there for a serial output where I can debug the boot
16:27 #navit: <+jkoan> And I hope it will arrive today
16:36 #navit: <@KaZeR> jkoan: ha nice! We could use some of the $$ we have in opencollective 
16:43 #navit:  * genesis is back.
16:44 #navit: < genesis> i don't know what you plan on the future website
16:45 #navit: < genesis> but wiki needs a good cleaning
16:46 #navit: < genesis> don't know if there real useful information on that
16:47 #navit: < genesis> hard to track to depreciation a wiki, a website with a generated documentation from a git repo with perharps less but easier to keep content relative to reality 
16:47 #navit: < genesis> i mean, is that someone competant would like to edit ? http://wiki.navit-project.org/index.php/Item_def.h
16:50 #navit: <+jkoan> KaZeR: the question is if this money should go to the effort to support new modern devices and probably bring out some navit device with some (Chinese) brand
16:56 #navit: <@KaZeR> genesis: i agree. This is why we started https://navit.readthedocs.io/en/latest/basic_configuration.html ( hosted here : https://github.com/navit-gps/navit/blob/readthedocs/docs/basic_configuration.rst )
16:57 #navit: <@KaZeR> wikis are nice to collect informations from various users, but very difficult to keep up to date and organized
16:57 #navit: <@KaZeR> jkoan: i think both. I was merely offering the option, if you don't want to take it then it's your call :)
16:57 #navit: < aerostitch> Hi guys. Sorry I haven't been able to find time for navit those last weeks/months :(
16:59 #navit: <+jkoan> Hi aerostitch nice to see you again :)
17:00 #navit: <+jkoan> KaZeR: I will think about it ;) but thx
17:00 #navit: < aerostitch> nice to see you too! :)
17:01 #navit: <+jkoan> aerostitch: what about a release to bring navit on debian up to date?
17:03 #navit: < aerostitch> sure. 5.1 has been in Debian since July ( https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/navit )
17:03 #navit: < genesis> i've to fix linker problem before :)
17:03 #navit: < aerostitch> but a release is needed right now
17:03 #navit: < aerostitch> I got 1 or 2 PR to do before the release
17:03 #navit: < aerostitch> if you have some PR you want to merge before the release too let me know
17:04 #navit: < genesis> it's anormal i've to fix like that : https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/blob/30ab2300bcf4d1e3e5bf031e67cd089aba828ea0/pkgs/applications/misc/navit/default.nix#L71
17:05 #navit: <+jkoan> Didn't know that it is more or less up to date. Why you need a release? ^^
17:06 #navit: < genesis> but for now, i'm working on motorhomes public POI, in both tomtom_asc and tomtom_ov2 format.
17:08 #navit: < genesis> (my guess is linkage is lazy and forget some library that are found runtime instead of proper linking buildtime)
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17:17 #navit: < genesis> my main caveat is default installation is not showing something working and usefull
17:18 #navit: < genesis> even i did the effort emulating dsamplemap that is not possible to do on proper distrib (when it checksums data and build in a sandbox, so an option should not try to get web)
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17:28 #navit: <@KaZeR> genesis: "not showing something working and useful" because of an outdated map? what's the issue exactly (haven't read all of the backlog yet)
17:29 #navit: < aerostitch> genesis: is your nix patch related to https://github.com/navit-gps/navit/pull/574 ? It looks like you're re-adding the navit directory to the library path right?
17:30 #navit: < genesis> i don't think so
17:30 #navit: < genesis> i don't populate my libPath with navit lib path.
17:31 #navit: < genesis> it would be $out/lib somewhere, i'm fixing for some dependancies lib missing and libc
17:34 #navit: < genesis> KaZeR : default navit.xml doesn't focus on munich and let a blank screen, i'd have fix it nix but they don't like to have big xml file in repo, so i've to make a better default conf somewhere else, on a gist for example
17:38 #navit: < Beggar> Is there any way to open an lsit or dialog in the first run of navit asking for the initial center map?
17:39 #navit: < Beggar> center map coordinates or country names something like this. I mean using the <gui> or osd
17:42 #navit: <@KaZeR> genesis: where does your default navit.xml focus on?
17:43 #navit: <@KaZeR> Beggar: not today, but it's something that we want to address with the new qml2 UI
17:43 #navit: < genesis> don't remember, i'll look at that later, too many // tasking here :)
17:44 #navit: < Beggar> KaZeR, not a problem, I can do it with some script and run navit throug it. thanks
17:44 #navit: < genesis> what i remember, is this orange screen by default, with the internal not adapted to desktop
17:44 #navit: < genesis> at begining, i thought navit was bugging and begin to update the recipe of my distro ;)
17:45 #navit: < genesis> i read a bit, and i'm really convinced it is slowing user adoption.
17:46 #navit: < genesis> nothing related to harder functionnality and bugs, that only few people will see if they don't abandoned there
17:47 #navit: < genesis> (i can't tell navit to make this my position or destination with favorite , it's not working there really)
17:47 #navit: <@KaZeR> Beggar: i'm definitely interested in your solution
17:48 #navit: <@KaZeR> "i read a bit, and i'm really convinced it is slowing user adoption." oh yeah we need to make it easier to use, that's for sure
17:48 #navit:  * Beggar hid his keyboard and put some crypto on the nano opened document.
17:49 #navit: < genesis> but i don't speak about hard feature, just change the default navit.xml and default map for people just understand it's working
17:49 #navit: < genesis> http://ozzmaker.com/navigating-navit-raspberry-pi/ example here
17:50 #navit: < genesis> lot of this step could be easily wrapper in a navit-setup script, or even a just smarter navit.xml.
17:51 #navit: < genesis> in fact , installing a software, you're not aware of what doing next
17:51 #navit: < genesis> on gentoo i'd some elog message noone read, on nixos i don't, but generally, people needs a hint on first launch
17:51 #navit: < Beggar> It should be nice to have a map from some weird place instead of germany, some very bad know island is a good bet. It will make the initial map also small and will show something to the user when he open navit. Nothing against Germany but looks tendentious 
17:51 #navit: < genesis> juste _a_hint_
17:52 #navit: < genesis> haha i like the munich one, syndrom of is well known :D
17:53 #navit: < Beggar> genesis,  also note... navit is not an intuitive tool to most people, the first eye contact does not help even a bit. What drives people on it are those >>fancy<< screeenshots
17:54 #navit: < genesis> but we can do a step
17:54 #navit: < genesis> not all the steps.
17:55 #navit: < Beggar> But for me the lack of an up to date text about how to set map is what make it hard. And I must admit I am pretty much curious about the >>NON DOCUMENTED OPTIONS<< of maptool haha
17:56 #navit: <@KaZeR> well what could help is to finish backporting the map download code. You start navit, it tells you that you need a map and offers options to download various maps
17:57 #navit: <@KaZeR> this currently works on android (but with a static list of maps)
17:57 #navit: < genesis> or just a desactivating splashscreen with links on a proper documentation
17:58 #navit: < genesis> i've to think about it, but i think you get more contrib when the first impression really matter
17:59 #navit: < genesis> how, i donno, but my point is, it's so easy to give a better impression right now, we could let a non focused default munich map let's people searching quickly another tools.
18:04 #navit: < genesis> s/couldn't
18:07 #navit: <@KaZeR> "i think you get more contrib when the first impression really matter" absolutely
18:09 #navit: < genesis> http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=b1dbe88328247737b357807ceb928c3f first impression on my distro today
18:10 #navit: < genesis> dispite my effort to make that works.
18:20 #navit: < Mineque> hi
18:24 #navit: < Beggar> hi
18:48 #navit: <@KaZeR> genesis: ha.
18:48 #navit: <@KaZeR> genesis: you have the map for that area right?
18:52 #navit: < genesis> yeap
18:53 #navit: < genesis> that's just poor default UI and focus pb
19:01 #navit: < Beggar> genesis, the Debian one has a plus and minus sign for the zoom besides the beige background
19:06 #navit: <@KaZeR> genesis: i am curious about that focus issue. Where is your map centered on right now?
19:15 #navit: < Beggar> http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=bb017e123f4dfebb98d1f27f27abce3c just do not mind the poor OSD, I am not good at it haha
19:26 #navit: <@KaZeR> Beggar: not bad!
19:26 #navit: <@KaZeR> also which device is that?
19:26 #navit: <@KaZeR> wince?
19:27 #navit: < Beggar> yes wince I do not knwo witch version but the device has 96MB RAM haha
19:28 #navit: <@KaZeR> Beggar: while working on another issue some time ago we added a way to detect the exact device for wince. It means that we can reuse your OSD for a given set of devices that match yours (mostly because of screen size and screen dpi)
--- Log closed Wed Aug 29 00:00:29 2018