[01:31:47] *** Quits: Horwitz (~mich1@p200300ec9f028900022268fffe64e7c4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [01:44:49] *** Joins: Horwitz (~mich1@p200300ec9f076900022268fffe64e7c4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) [01:44:49] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Horwitz [03:32:57] *** Quits: ilovekiruna (~ilovekiru@2a02:8108:d00:110:d96c:93f4:8be1:474b) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [03:33:28] *** Quits: Celelibi (celelibi@82-64-105-152.subs.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) [07:53:42] *** Joins: Celelibi (celelibi@2a01:e0a:587:56f0:215:afff:fe49:d5cd) [07:56:40] *** Joins: ilovekiruna (~ilovekiru@ip1f129c09.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) [07:56:40] *** ChanServ sets mode: +v ilovekiruna [09:17:08] *** Quits: Navit (~Navit@ec2-34-214-224-248.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) (Remote host closed the connection) [09:17:20] *** Joins: Navit (~Navit@ec2-34-214-224-248.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) [09:17:20] *** ChanServ sets mode: +v Navit [09:21:14] *** Quits: kazer (~kazer@ec2-54-70-178-135.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) [09:22:53] *** Joins: kazer (~kazer@ec2-54-70-178-135.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) [09:22:53] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o kazer [12:14:27] hi all [12:14:37] am finally back on my old hardware again, so will be roaming around more here [15:42:23] kewl :) [15:45:03] genesis, I looked at nixos also again, as I am getting a new computer [15:45:19] however, I cant still get behind the idea of having hashed directories [15:45:30] I believe there can be really use-cases for it [15:47:56] i think in that case, I would use a container instead [15:57:24] this way we can have many version of the same thing, with support change [15:58:07] it behave like everything is self contained, rely only on explicit path [15:58:37] but if you don't go deeper, you can't understand why nix is so much wonderful. [15:59:24] if you don't understand how nix build saves life on many stuff [15:59:38] reproducible build, env [16:00:26] I only need a repoducible image [16:00:44] doesnt it save every configation in an own folder named with a hash? [16:02:11] what do u mean ? [16:03:05] let me quote wikipedia: Nix is a cross-platform package manager that utilizes a purely functional deployment model where software is installed into unique directories generated through cryptographic hashes, it is also the name of the programming language. [16:03:09] do u read https://nixos.org/features.html ? [16:03:29] yes it install things in /nix/store [16:03:38] and this is what I dont like [16:03:42] I prefer the fhs [16:03:57] like /nix/store/86ms46lvm9qsxgfpzbjal25byjjcbs88-navit-unstable-2020-14-10 [16:04:05] but fhs doesn't work... [16:04:25] so my point is, if I need sth special, I can also do it in a container [16:04:27] you can enjoy the features of nix using a classic file collision model like fhs. [16:04:39] can't [16:04:52] if you think you can do that, you don't understand the issue. [16:05:14] then please explain me, why I cant install different versions if I use a container [16:05:23] and have one dedicated version just in that container [16:06:15] because in my opinion on a high level view the store just acts like a container, app-image, etc. [16:06:32] where you can have application specific library versions [16:07:12] but it is only limited to the cases where I really need it, not the whole system [16:07:24] because you don't admit [16:07:32] whey you install package Y depending on X [16:08:07] you could update X to X2 , that could interfere with packag B depend on X1 too, but you think [16:08:21] my first assumption is that those are rare cases, that I need a specific version of package Y [16:08:38] and i told you that the 100% case [16:09:09] as I said, i barely face such an issue [16:09:34] and since you minor it, you don't see the importance of doing that, and 99% the package B has not be tested and you have introduice hazardous, and luckyly it works fine [16:10:10] but anyway, you keed seing the store has a toy, and that's a so fine point of the iceberg nix provide [16:10:25] I dont call the store a toy [16:10:33] I think it is the main key about nix [16:11:05] i works on linux since 20 years, i would not return on a system without such a store, and a real language to build stuff efficiently [16:11:10] what is a toy ? appimage. [16:11:11] same here [16:11:21] I use also linux since 2000 [16:14:35] anyway, nix store is the package manager with the most package and update https://repology.org/repositories/statistics/nonunique [16:15:17] interesting comparison, but really depends on what is counted as a package [16:15:58] for nixos, a main interest is the infra, and you'll discover all that only trying it anyway [16:16:34] anyway, i know it's a bit impossible to convince people on such subject. [16:17:41] perharps a gentoist fed up with some incompatible package @ rebuild world, someone need a common build tool for a team of various distro linux user [16:18:19] someone woud want easy deployement (nixops) or reproducible enviroment in the time, someone managing cluster and so. [16:18:39] for cluster I would anyway using CentOS [16:19:39] or to reproduce my simulations on different machines, put everything in a singularity container [16:19:56] so that I dont need to rebuild things, but have a binary image [16:29:55] CentOS because simply some of the softwares support only a very small set of distributions [16:30:00] and usually RHEL is among them [16:32:21] yes, but fact is we have the most important and updated collection. Do you package officially for centos ? [16:35:20] no, and why should I? [16:35:41] so you only use thing that are packaging for your distro by others [16:35:53] for centos, I even have no choice [16:36:01] as I am not root on the clusters [16:36:55] I also DID build some rpm packages, but only if I would really need [16:37:01] and that doesnt happen often [16:37:30] i know that this is a pita [16:37:55] i did 28 packages on nixpkgs, and more on my personnal nixpkgs repo [16:38:13] because it's easy and i'm interesting in build system [16:38:41] if people has not root on a server, they can still use nix anyway [16:38:59] since a store also provide a way to do that. [16:39:34] since my repo is backed by cachix.org, the build cache of my package are also available for people [16:41:20] anyway you are not so interesting so you can't see the way it replace a lot of things in a clean way [17:03:36] to me this cache sounds like a bin host [17:03:54] but maybe I am wrong [17:21:19] speaking of nix, i can look for github action if people are interesting [17:22:13] but i don't know about sailfish, so i won't build support for it, but should easy to add [17:22:27] (rewrite rules for the docker thingy) [20:41:26] *** Quits: ilovekiruna (~ilovekiru@ip1f129c09.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Remote host closed the connection) [21:07:39] *** Joins: ilovekiruna (~ilovekiru@2a02:8108:d00:110:d96c:93f4:8be1:474b) [21:07:39] *** ChanServ sets mode: +v ilovekiruna [22:10:14] is there some navit devel on macos here ?